let's start a whole new discussion on funan. i read Cambodge's comments on the royal lineage connection of funan,chenla and angkor. what he said is very true about this connection. read below:


http://www.angkorwat.org/html/history.html

i have long been a skeptic of funan being a khmer kingdom but seeing that this royal lineage was connected from the funan era to chenla and finally to angkor, i think it is safe to say that funan was in fact a khmer kingdom. chenla became a vassal of funan is still a mystery though. why didn't the funan rulers incorporate chenla with funan? since both leaders were related.

It can be compared to the Greek City-States. Think of Chenla as Sparta and Funan as Anthens, both City-State was Greek and independent of each other, but Anthens became a vassal of Sparta.

There is no mystery, it actually happens a lot. Independent factions/city of the same nation conquering for power, resources, territory or whatever reason.

yeah that's probably true. chenla was unable to become a strong state like funan because it did not have access to the sea and trading. there were definitely factions going on. just like in vietnamese history where all these different warlords compete for power. also, the customs and traditions of funan is identical to chenla and angkor even the native traditions of ancestral worship according to the chinese account.

also i likd to add, funan became a trading center mainly due to the indians who settled there. like in the link i posted, it mentioned king chandan of funan possibly being of indian descent. before i thought funan was actually a malay kingdom because malays also did extensive trading in the region but indians did also.

nombaingsachko, I am glad that you have finally realized that the states of Funan and Chenla were all for one and one for all. The Khmer history clearly states that the first Khmer state is called Nokor Phnom and the second sister state is called Chenla. Lineage of the Funan and Chenal kings show that "the Chenla's skings were descendants from the Nokor Phnom's Royal Family." (Sou Ketya
M.A., 1997) Chenla was established after Nokor Phnom by King Jayavarman who was a son of King Rudravarman, the King of Nokor Phnom. In AD 550, Prince Bhavavarman the grandson of King Rudravarman of Nokor Phnom became king of Chenla upon the Chenla king's death, and in addition when the Funan king died, he also incorporated Funan into the state of Chenla as well.



According to Sou Ketya, MA (1997), "The war between Chenla and Nokor Phnom was a war aimed at seizing the throne and power. Chenla was established after Nokor Phnom, because the latter was located in a plain, which was more favorable than Chenla to be influenced by Indian culture passed by trading vessels. Then when Chenla became a kingdom it began to wage wars with a neighboring country with the same bloodline to expand the territory and power. ... Chenla was Nokor Phnom ‘s tributary state. In the late sixth century – the early seventh century, King Bhavarman and his brother, Citrasena (called Mahindravarman afterwards) decided to revolt,liberate from Nokor Phnom and declare its independence."

In my personal opinion I think the Kings of Chenla resented the fact that the Kings of Funan made the Kings of Chenla paid tributes EVEN though the rules of both states are RELATED and ALL. King Bhavarman and his brother Mahindravarman decided to put an end to this GREAT DIVIDE and UNNECESSARY SUBORDINATION between the two sister STATES. Therefore, when the LAST GREAT King Rudravarman of Funan died, King Bhavarman of Chenla decided to also RULE Funan because of his familial relationship to the late great King of Funan. When Funan and Chenla became ONE state, then there would no need to PAY the tributes to anyone. ALL was ONE and ONE was ALL.

I would like to now caution you, nombaingsachko, that OUR predatory neighbors the Viets and the Thais are presently trying really hard with their so-called EVIDENCE to PROVE that the people of Funan were destroyed by the Khmer people, and the present-day Cambodians are not the same as the Khmer people of Angkor Empire. Hahhah. In other words, the Viet scholars are saying that the Khmer occupied and destroyed Funan and its people. The Viet scholars said that they know that the people of Funan were different from the Khmer people because they ONLY found the written language of Funan to be in Sanskrit. Hahhah. It is like saying that you and I are not Khmer because we only WRITE in English. Hahhah. What about the Viets themselves? When did they ever have written language? Hahhah. In fact they used the Chinese characters for their written language, so does that mean the Viets themselves are not Viets but of other race instead? Hhahha. The Thai scholars also said that the present-day Cambodians are Thai people who migrated into Cambodia after the Thai victorious warriors killed and chased away the fallen Khmer of Angkor Empire. Hhahahh. The Thai scholars also said that the reason why the country name was changed to Cambodia from Kamboja because it was to reflect the new type of people inhabiting the country. Hahhah.

These predatory Thais and Viets they are trying very hard to strip off our Khmerness and identity. However, we will continue to laugh at their FACES for many millions years to come, encoding the message that "WE KHMER PEOPLE STILL LIVE NOW AND FOREVER MORE and WE WILL CONTINUE TO LAUGH AT STUPIDITY and TREACHERY."

In summary, the people of Funan were predominantly of Mon-Khmer stock, and so were the people of Chenla. Even in the present, the great majority of the people of Cambodia are of the Mon-Khmer stock. If the Viets claim that people of Funan did not speak the Khmer language then why has the chronology of the ruling kings shown that the ruling kings of both Funan and Chenla were related biologically in BLOOD? In fact, even the Chinese called the state of Funan by the Khmer word. Hahhahah. How did that happen if the State of Funan had long been in existent way longer than the state of Chenla? Hhahah. Who created the latter state of Chenla? It was the SON of the King of Funan. Hahahhaha. What language did the Kings of Chenla speak? It was Khmer. Hhahah. Who united Funan and Chenla together? It was the Funan prince who was the grandson of the ruling king of Funan. Hhahha. What did the Funan prince who UNITED Funan and Chenla speak? He spoke Khmer. Hhahhah. How do you know that the Kings from Funan who ruled Chenla speak Khmer? The evidence is the written Khmer carved in stone. Hhahahah. Recently, I have read an article in English by the State of Communist Vietnam who talked about the cultural ancient artifacts of the people of Oc Eo. Those ancient artifacts were of the people of Funan and the name of the site is a Khmer name also (O' Keo to be exact). However, the Viets don't tell the world that those artifacts were of the ancient Khmer people becaus they are afraid that the world WILL know the Viet people as the land-grabbing thieves of the Khmer ancestral land. Hahhaha.


Now I have exposed the Vietnamese treachery against the Khmer people.

The Thais also said that the present-day Cambodians are not Khmer of Angkor Empire. The Thais said that the present-day Cambodians are actually of Thai origins. Hhahahha. If it is so then why the present-day Cambodians still continue to speak and write Khmer and not the Thai language? Hhahahahh.

^I know some Viet and Thai scholars that actualy believe in that garbage.

Thats when you fight Fire with Fire. I told that Viet scholar... Viets are in FACT of Mon-Khmer stock, hence there language. Before the Chinese expansion of the south, they too were Dark skined, round eyed, curly haired people like the Ancient Khmers. Centuries of Chinese rule, rape, and plunder sinosized there gene pool and writing system, and turned them into light skined, strait haired chineses. A Viet with a tan and a perm can easily fool you as khmer.. LOL

As for the Thai's. Before SukoThai, there were a band of tribes people called the Tai Padong...... I took there "Khom Padong" theory and spin it back at them.

I hope not sending a bad messege... Please dont figt fire with fire. Fight fire with fact. And Cambodge... I commend your for this..... You know your Sh!t.

i find it so hard to believe that funan was a seafaring "malay" state.. how in the world did the khmers of chenla annihilated these people so quickly if funan was indeed a malay state? wouldn't it take hundreds of years to do so considering how powerful and wealthy funan was during its hey day. look at how long it took dai viet to fully conquer and absorb champa.. it took them like 5 centuries to do so plus champa is way smaller than funan. not only that, when chenla took over, the territorial boundary did not change much when funan was around. makes you wonder about these so called "scholars" who dispute the idea of funan being the first khmer kingdom..

Considering the earlier kingdom was on the east; couldnt it be said that it was related to cham and in fact a malay kingdom, rather than khmer? Did the khmers recieve influence from the malay people, who infact were hindus beforehand?

LOL u got ur source from a http://www.angkorwat[SIZE=7].org/html/history.html? any american source for this?

Actually, the kingdom's capital was initially located in Vyadhapura, near Phnom Penh, and then later relocated to what is now Oc Eo.

Champa's ancestors reached the mainland sometime in the 1st and 2nd century BCE and established their kingdom around 192CE, whereas it is thought that Funan state was established in the 1st century CE. Legend has it that an Indian Brahimin and a Khmer princess began the lineage of the royal family. So by the time Champa had established it's kingdom, Funan was only 100 years away from reaching it's peak.

Actually, the kingdom's capital was initially located in Vyadhapura, near Phnom Penh, and then later relocated to what is now Oc Eo.

Champa's ancestors reached the mainland sometime in the 1st and 2nd century BCE and established their kingdom around 192CE, whereas it is thought that Funan state was established in the 1st century CE. Legend has it that an Indian Brahimin and a Khmer princess began the lineage of the royal family. So by the time Champa had established it's kingdom, Funan was only 100 years away from reaching it's peak.

I dont really give too much credibility to legend and lure; I think that the funan kingdom was populated by malays; considering malays were one of the earlier asian races; it is very possible. As well malays are brown in skin tone, short; same as the khmer people. Could there be any relation at all? Probably so..

Either way, Funan had established itself 100 years before Champa did.