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Asia Finest Discussion Forum > Asian Culture > Japanese Chat > Japanese Serious Talk
jareth_chong
What exactly is in the newly approved school history textbook that has ignited waves of anti-Japanese protests in China and South Korea? confused.gif

Does anyone have a URL to the actual relevant contents? Please, no paraphrase as everyone knows it will be biased.
generalissimo_z
Basically it reduces the war to an "incident".

It says that Japan in it's invasions "liberated" asian nations from western imperialism.

The textbook alleged that the Lugou Bridge (also known as the Macro Polo Bridge) Incident in north China on July 7, 1937, which marked the beginning of the war, was triggered by China.

It also challenged the validity of the 1937 Nanking Massacre.
khu91x
Lol , they really think they can hide the truth from their own people when the rest of the world's textbooks are different. embarassedlaugh.gif2 embarassedlaugh.gif2 embarassedlaugh.gif2
Jaimu-Jaimu
Has anyone got all the background information about the textbook?

Where is the book being used (if it is being used), who is publishing it etc.? I've asked some people about it but if you ask a Japanese person, they defend it so I feel like I'm not getting the whole story.
Ducky
QUOTE (khu91x @ Apr 13 2005, 02:02 AM)
Lol , they really think they can hide the truth from their own people when the rest of the world's textbooks are different.  -laugh2  -laugh2  -laugh2
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"Truth. "
That's the core of this dispute.

History should be the subject of science and not a fantasy.


--------------------------------------
Please refer to all my posts.
kpjoon
I was pretty pissed at the news until I read that 0.1% of japanese schools actually use this textbook...
item1702
QUOTE (kpjoon @ Apr 16 2005, 01:48 AM)
I was pretty pissed at the news until I read that 0.1% of japanese schools actually use this textbook...
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0.1%! Damn it! fu-k it! It's time to riot! icon_confused.gif sure.gif

embarassedlaugh.gif2
anlong7931
QUOTE (kpjoon @ Apr 16 2005, 01:48 AM)
I was pretty pissed at the news until I read that 0.1% of japanese schools actually use this textbook...
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LOOOL!!!!
barkerintokyo
Anyone here who says anything about the inside of the textbook is basically lying, basing their information on false information, or is misinformed.

The Japanese Ministry of Education does not release the insides of the textbooks during screening processes and any inside material that people may know of now is either fabricated or has been obtained illegally.

However, we can hypothesize the inside of the textbook based on what the Society of History Textbook Reform published in 2001. The "New Textbook" that they published in 2001 contained no mention of military comfort women (taking the official stance that they believe it did not occur) and mentions only slightly the Naking Massacre, only referring to it as something that some believe occurred. It passed the strict Ministry of Education's standards meaning that none of it is historically inaccurate. However, Chinese and Koreans feel that it does not address certain issues adequately. Also included in the textbook are wills of Japanese soldiers and passages that state the fact that Japan had liberated several countries under western colonial rule. Also, instead of the commonly used "Pacific War," they refer to WWII in Asia as "Daito-a War" meaning the Greater East Asia War, a term that was used during WWII. There were several more controversial points but nothing too serious.

Keep in mind that this is a MIDDLE SCHOOL textbook and its passing of the tests does not mean that it will be used by schools. Plus, no one actually knows the contents of this textbook yet.
questionnaire
Bah, I bet 95% percent of Japanese don't know whether Nanjing exists.
Kalee Flavour
I thougth those crimes where never teached to Japanese people. Even not within the old text books. Why does a lot of Japanese people don't know about their war crimes?
item1702
QUOTE (questionnaire @ Apr 16 2005, 12:45 PM)
Bah, I bet 95% percent of Japanese don't know whether Nanjing exists.
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I'd bet you are wrong. icon_wink.gif

QUOTE (Kalee Flavour @ Apr 16 2005, 04:10 PM)
I thougth those crimes where never teached to Japanese people. Even not within the old text books. Why does a lot of Japanese people don't know about their war crimes?
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icon_confused.gif
barkerintokyo
Okay, this is where Chinese have been blatantly brainwashed.

Japanese people DO know of alleged WWII era crimes. In fact, the leftists in the government have been forcing Japanese textbooks to include military comfort women and Nanking Massacre and other things in MIDDLE SCHOOL textbook since the 1982 textbook incident. Japanese people are brainwashed into believing that their own race is the evil race of the world. Japanese people's brains stop functioning as soon as it comes to WWII. Japanese people illogically being apologizing and believing that they were the agressors and committed terrible atrocities without questioning WHY some people believe so.

The Japanese textbooks have historically painted Japan as an EVIL nation for the past twenty years. Currently, there's only ONE company that tries to see Japan differently and they're under extreme leftist attack. This company's writers get death threats and verbal abuse on TV in Japan. They are exersizing their right to free speech, but Japanese people have been brainwashed so badly to think that Japan is the evil race that they cannot allow people to say otherwise. All the other textbooks are still blatantly anti-Japan. Japan is the only country with a textbook that bashes itself.

Military comfort women have been proven to not exist so these days more and more textbooks are choosing not to place them in the textbooks. Nanking Massacre and other alleged events are still in textbooks. Just because ONE textbook decides not to put them in for LEGITIMATE reasons does not make Japan a whitewasher of history.
kpjoon
QUOTE (questionnaire @ Apr 16 2005, 12:45 PM)
Bah, I bet 95% percent of Japanese don't know whether Nanjing exists.
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I heard the majority of Japan doesn't even know that this Tokto/Takeshima argument is going on.
skat3r
QUOTE (kpjoon @ Apr 16 2005, 01:48 AM)
I was pretty pissed at the news until I read that 0.1% of japanese schools actually use this textbook...
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Look at it from a Jewish perspective.

Even if a single page used even in one school denied the holocaust then the outrage would be tremendous i mean such a thing would even make it in the media. So should this be any different?

Same situation. All Japanese youths should now about these things and not one is exempt. It took a handful of militarists to cause chaos and havoc in asia and besides the other textbooks aren't all that much better.
BRAdJiPARk
QUOTE (barkerintokyo @ Apr 16 2005, 09:22 PM)
Okay, this is where Chinese have been blatantly brainwashed.

Japanese people DO know of alleged WWII era crimes. In fact, the leftists in the government have been forcing Japanese textbooks to include military comfort women and Nanking Massacre and other things in MIDDLE SCHOOL textbook since the 1982 textbook incident. Japanese people are brainwashed into believing that their own race is the evil race of the world. Japanese people's brains stop functioning as soon as it comes to WWII. Japanese people illogically being apologizing and believing that they were the agressors and committed terrible atrocities without questioning WHY some people believe so.

The Japanese textbooks have historically painted Japan as an EVIL nation for the past twenty years. Currently, there's only ONE company that tries to see Japan differently and they're under extreme leftist attack. This company's writers get death threats and verbal abuse on TV in Japan. They are exersizing their right to free speech, but Japanese people have been brainwashed so badly to think that Japan is the evil race that they cannot allow people to say otherwise. All the other textbooks are still blatantly anti-Japan. Japan is the only country with a textbook that bashes itself.

Military comfort women have been proven to not exist so these days more and more textbooks are choosing not to place them in the textbooks. Nanking Massacre and other alleged events are still in textbooks. Just because ONE textbook decides not to put them in for LEGITIMATE reasons does not make Japan a whitewasher of history.
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What the fu-ck are you talking about??!! Dude you are only making yourself look more stupid. OK, this is gonna be my last time arguing against you because you are so stupid and brainwashed that itz not even funny. Let me just tell you a few things: First of all, Comfort women DID exist and were used by your country, Japan WAS an aggressor during WWII, Japan DID use actual humans for experimentation, and they DID massacre millions of people during Japan Imperialism. Overall, your country was really fu cked up, and they fu cked up your brain as well.
freefallz
QUOTE (barkerintokyo @ Apr 16 2005, 09:22 PM)
Okay, this is where Chinese have been blatantly brainwashed.

Japanese people DO know of alleged WWII era crimes. In fact, the leftists in the government have been forcing Japanese textbooks to include military comfort women and Nanking Massacre and other things in MIDDLE SCHOOL textbook since the 1982 textbook incident. Japanese people are brainwashed into believing that their own race is the evil race of the world. Japanese people's brains stop functioning as soon as it comes to WWII. Japanese people illogically being apologizing and believing that they were the agressors and committed terrible atrocities without questioning WHY some people believe so.

The Japanese textbooks have historically painted Japan as an EVIL nation for the past twenty years. Currently, there's only ONE company that tries to see Japan differently and they're under extreme leftist attack. This company's writers get death threats and verbal abuse on TV in Japan. They are exersizing their right to free speech, but Japanese people have been brainwashed so badly to think that Japan is the evil race that they cannot allow people to say otherwise. All the other textbooks are still blatantly anti-Japan. Japan is the only country with a textbook that bashes itself.

Military comfort women have been proven to not exist so these days more and more textbooks are choosing not to place them in the textbooks. Nanking Massacre and other alleged events are still in textbooks. Just because ONE textbook decides not to put them in for LEGITIMATE reasons does not make Japan a whitewasher of history.
*

I think what you are trying to show us is that Japan or any other country for that matter cannot be entirely evil. Japan committed their mistakes through misjudgements and misinformation, and not by their 'evilness'. This I agree. I mean, all governments have a greedy attitude for dominance and power. But I think what the textbooks also have to highlight are the severe consequences of the actions taken by Japan during WW2 and how SERIOUS their mistake was. Education on WW2 from Japan's perspective isn't about demonising themselves as what you've suggested on the former textbooks. Nonetheless it needs to deliver the information in regards to all of the incidents that occurred. This includes the Nanjing massacre. It is not a myth, or rumour. The massacre most definitely took place as what it's described to be. Suggesting the debatable validity of incident is almost equivalent to stating 9/11 never happened assuming there have been no live television broadcast during the two plane crashes.

If Japan carried out the atrocities on their own people, then it'll be up to your government to do what they feel is appropriate. However this is what Japan did to ANOTHER country on FOREIGN soil. It is not only your responsibiliity but also part of China's role to urge your education editors in informing your people about the accepted TRUTH. Telling the truth doesn't mean Japan would be portrayed as 'evil', it merely goes on to show the mistake the Japanese government, and some of their soldiers had commited. What really grants a conscience to be evil ultimately entails subjective interpretations, let alone deciding for an entire nation of people. This 'evil mentality' problem is Japan's own consequences for doing what they did in WW2. Trying to overcome this obstacle by denying the facts isn't really appropriate.
barkerintokyo
The Japanese government does not deny facts. The official stance of the government is to apologize to China whenever possible.

The only people who deny certain "stories" are people like me and various other intellectuals.

Oh and Bradjipark, if you say so, I guess it HAS to be true right? (intense sarcasm intended).
freefallz
You can deny certain accusations, but this is a major incident. If you are really an intellectual, then you should have the wisdom to see that despite the apparent number inadequacies proposed by PRC, the Nanjing Massacre did take place and it's number count (whatever it maybe) is likely to be under a comparable scale (not mathematically) to, ie large in nature, the implications of the alleged claims.
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