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chynagongju
QUOTE
Friday, February 18, 2005 · Last updated 6:29 a.m. PT

Japan, U.S. to revise security alliance

By NATALIE OBIKO PEARSON
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER

TOKYO -- Japan's foreign minister and defense chief reportedly flew to Washington on Friday to discuss a major revision to the U.S.-Japan security alliance that would for the first time identify tensions between China and Taiwan as a flashpoint in Asia.

The United States' security alliance with Japan has formed the backbone of American foreign policy in Asia since the 1960s. But the two allies have long disagreed about how to deal with China's territorial claim over self-ruled Taiwan, which split with Beijing amid civil war in 1949.

Washington has indicated it would intervene if China was to try to take Taiwan by force, while a cautious Japan has traditionally sought to avoid involvement.

But during talks Saturday in Washington, Foreign Minister Nobutaka Machimura, Defense Agency chief Yoshinori Ono, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld plan to adopt "common strategic objectives" that would include ensuring security in Taiwan and on the Korean Peninsula, the Kyodo News Agency reported.

Tokyo's shift on Taiwan would be a strong demonstration of solidarity with the U.S. position and would signal a more assertive Japanese stance in the region. The United States and Japan share an interest in checking China's growing military and economic clout.

Japan adopted new defense guidelines in December singling out China's growing military as a threat. That followed an incursion into Japan's southern territorial waters by a Chinese naval submarine that prompted Tokyo to put its military on alert for only the second time in half a century.

In a draft security document, the two sides describe hostilities across the Taiwan Strait and on the Korean Peninsula as "unpredictable and unstable factors in the region" that need to be addressed, Kyodo said.

The document, first reported in The Washington Post, would be the most significant change in the security alliance since 1996.

The document does not specify military cooperation between Tokyo and Washington to resolve the Taiwanese conflict, Kyodo said.

But it urges China to resolve the issue peacefully through dialogue and to be more transparent about the rapid modernization of its military, the report said. Beijing's military buildup in recent years is viewed by experts as a sign it is prepared to carry out its frequent threats of invasion if Taiwan declares formal independence.

But any moves by Tokyo to wield influence in Asia also could raise alarm bells in the region, where many remain wary of renewed Japanese militarism after its invasion and colonization of much of the region in the first half of the 20th century.

A Foreign Ministry spokeswoman said on condition of anonymity that the Taiwan issue was being considered for the agenda of Saturday's meeting.

Taiwan's special envoy to Japan, Koh Se-kai, welcomed news of Tokyo's changing attitude.

"We're relieved that Japan has become more assertive," Se-kai said, according to James Tin, a spokesman for Taipei's Economic and Cultural Representative Office in Japan.

Japan has had formal diplomatic ties with China since 1972 but not Taiwan.

Relations between Japan and China already are poor despite ever-growing trade and investment flows between the two Asian powers. Recently, they have clashed over disputed islands in the East China Sea and competing rights to explore natural gas deposits.

At a previous meeting in December 2002, U.S. and Japanese officials issued a joint statement that only briefly touched on the importance of China's "playing a positive and constructive role in the enhancement of regional stability" without specifically mentioning Taiwan.

That was consistent with Tokyo's past unwillingness to endorse a proposed U.S. arms sale to Taiwan to head off a possible Chinese invasion of Taiwan.


Any thoughts on what China's response will be and what this means for future relations? Increased strain between China and Japan? China and US?
Chinese DesertFox
Back to the good ol' "China threat."

Americans are so predictable.
DetunedRadio
Japan will one day have to chose between the Americans or the Chinese to side with.
chynagongju
QUOTE (DetunedRadio @ Feb 18 2005, 01:27 PM)
Japan will one day have to chose between the Americans or the Chinese to side with.
*

Does it not seem like they have chosen the Americans over the Chinese already?
DetunedRadio
QUOTE (chynagongju @ Feb 18 2005, 02:27 PM)
QUOTE (DetunedRadio @ Feb 18 2005, 01:27 PM)
Japan will one day have to chose between the Americans or the Chinese to side with.
*

Does it not seem like they have chosen the Americans over the Chinese already?
*


remember that the Japanese are very patriotic and singular people even now. They were defeated by the US and the US helped their country rebuild so naturally, the Japanese feel an affinity with the US.

But that could change once history is forgotten and the old generation of Japanese dies.

Today's young Japanese don't particularly hate the chinese nor do they particularly love the AMericans even if their culture is very americanized.

Many Japanese still feel an allegiance and a cultural affinity with China, who once influenced Japan so. Not even the Japanese can deny that Japan was once a satellite state of China.

But by practical means, if China becomes the next superpower and with Japan being so near China, it would just be practical for Japan and China to cooperate.
blatant
^ an "alligence"

*snort*

don't get me started.
Jasel
QUOTE (DetunedRadio @ Feb 18 2005, 02:34 PM)
QUOTE (chynagongju @ Feb 18 2005, 02:27 PM)
QUOTE (DetunedRadio @ Feb 18 2005, 01:27 PM)
Japan will one day have to chose between the Americans or the Chinese to side with.
*

Does it not seem like they have chosen the Americans over the Chinese already?
*


remember that the Japanese are very patriotic and singular people even now. They were defeated by the US and the US helped their country rebuild so naturally, the Japanese feel an affinity with the US.

But that could change once history is forgotten and the old generation of Japanese dies.

Today's young Japanese don't particularly hate the chinese nor do they particularly love the AMericans even if their culture is very americanized.

Many Japanese still feel an allegiance and a cultural affinity with China, who once influenced Japan so. Not even the Japanese can deny that Japan was once a satellite state of China.

But by practical means, if China becomes the next superpower and with Japan being so near China, it would just be practical for Japan and China to cooperate.
*



I really don't see that happening.
Musashino
I don't see what is so surprising about what this article is reporting.

We all know that tensions between Japan and China have been escalating.

We all know that many Chinese people are extremely resentful (and maybe even hateful) towards the Japanese and their past history with them.

We all know that China's newfound status as a military and economic powerhouse will send tremors towards the doorsteps of Tokyo, Taipei and Washington.

We all know that because Washington isn't always a reliable ally, Tokyo was bound to do more to ensure that its national borders are safe.

What I find amusing is that the Chinese side seem almost surprised that Japan is taking steps to further enhance her national security. Did China expect Japan to remain fully pacifist and stand by while China grows at a rapid pace?
blatant
this is all depressing.

at least i can live with the comfort of knowing that i can leech of japan for its entertainment.
Onebrutaltruth
[quote=Chinese DesertFox,Feb 24 2005, 04:28 AM]


ok u stinkies wait we,ll teach u there,s no such a thing as one china inner mongolia tibet taiwan must be happy what can make them happy Only independence can do it.once again there,s no one china stinkies


[quote=Onebrutaltruth,Feb 23 2005, 10:14 PM][quote=Yuje,Feb 24 2005, 02:29 AM][quote=Onebrutaltruth,Feb 23 2005, 02:40 PM]U DUMB U KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE HISTORY ALL THAT U SAID IS JUST A BULL $hit .INNER MONGOLIAN PEOPLE SUFFERIN BECAUSE OF COMUNIST GOVERMENT THEY KILLED A LOT OF INNOCENT(INNER) MONGOLIAN PEOPLE
THEY WANT TO UNITE WITH THE OUTER MONGOLIAN,THEY NEVER WANTED TO BE PART OF COMUNIST CHINA.THEY,RE SUFFERIN THEY WANT TO REUNITE
ONCE BEIJING WAS JUST A SMALL STINKIN VILLAGE.MONGOLS HAVE CONQUERED CHINA AND MADE THAT AS A BIG CITY.
INNER MONGOLIAN PEOPLE ARE SUFFERIN UNDER COMUNIST CHINA
WHERE,S THE HUMAN RIGHT



[/quote]

If people in Inner Mongolia are suffering, why aren't we seeing tons and tons of refugees fleeing north? Why does Inner Mongolia have more people? Why didn't Inner Mongolia ever declare independence? Are you just going to answer me with bigger fonts and more exclamation marks?



[/quote]


I THINK CHINA WILL SOON FALL APART L;IKE DOG,S $hit AND BY THE WAY
ALL U STINKIES LISTEN UP ONCE AGAIN U DUMB ASSES KNOW NOTHING ALL U CAN DO IS ONLY BUBBLIN ALL TOGETHER IN YOUR fu-kIN LANGUAGE
IF INNER MONGOLIA WANT TO SEPERATE FROM CHINA,(THEY STILL WANT IT)WHAT U THINK UNDER THE COMUNIST REGIME IT,S FOR NOW IMPOSSIBLE
BUT IN THE FUTURE WHO KNOWS .
INNER MONGOLIAN PPL LIVE IN THEIR HOMELAND
WHAT FOR GOIN TO ANOTHER COUNTRY OR SOMEWHERE ELSE U DUMB THEY,RE LIVIN IN THEIR COUNTRY AND IN THEIR LAND.ONLY CHINESE MUST LEAVE INNER MONGOLIA.I KNOW ONE THING FOR SURE THAT DUMB CHINESE GOVERMENT HAVE KILLED A LOT OF INNOCENT INNER MONGOLIAN PPL FOR THAT,THAT THEY WANT TO BE SEPERATED.MANY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SUFFERED OF IT.AND THOSE WITNESSES ARE STILL ALIVE SOME OF THEM LIVIN IN AMERYCA OR EUROPE AND IN MY COUNTRY TOO(GERMANY).THAT,S WHY I KNOW THE FACT
DU ARSCH WEISS NICHTS
INNER MONGOLIAN PEOPLE MUST BE HAPPY WHAT CAN HELP TO MAKE THEM HAPPY ?INDEPENDENCE ONLY CAN DO IT .



[/quote]
i wonder how could China will fall apart...right now most people live in those areas are chinese......HAN CHINESE>.

MANY COUNTRIES LIKE AMERYCA JAPAN BRITAIN GERMANY FRANCE KOREA
CANADA EVEN RUSSIA WANTS (GEOPOLITICALLY) SEPERATED POOR SMASHED CHINA
EVERYBODY IN THIS WORLD WANTS AND THINKIN THAT CHINA MUST BE FALL INTO A BANCH OF PIECES (LIKE DOGS $hit)
IT DOESNT DEPEND ON WHAT CHINA WANTS AND TO BE
IT DEPENDS ON US!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF AMERYCA WANTS AND WE WANT IT CHINA MUST GO AND FOLLOW THE WAY THAT WE,RE SHOWIN U OK STINKIES
WHAT GOOD WILL CHINA DO? TOO MANY UN-USEFUL PEOPLE AND THROW ONE NUCLEAR BOMB THAT,S ALL THERE,S NO CHINA ANYMORE

DONT FORGET IT DEPENDS ON US
U STINKIES WAIT FOR THAT SOON WE WILL TEACH U
Thierry Tecumseh
The current road japan's walking, I'm afraid, is the set with the sun in the west. But i do not know whether we could trust china. The best thing japan could do is be independant and neutral, using good diplomacy to pacify relations with china at the same time maintaining good will with the US. But as expected some cheap mouths in japan's politics are offending a growing giant in too many ways.
Ogumo
QUOTE (Thierry Tecumseh @ Mar 6 2005, 03:16 AM)
The current road japan's walking, I'm afraid, is the set with the sun in the west. But i do not know whether we could trust china. The best thing japan could do is be independant and neutral, using good diplomacy to pacify relations with china at the same time maintaining good will with the US. But as expected some cheap mouths in japan's politics are offending a growing giant in too many ways.
*



QUOTE
But i do not know whether we could trust china.


I personally do not think we can trust china either. Simply because of the history between the two and china's enormous size compared to japan. The larger will always attempt to exploit and dominate the smaller one.

QUOTE
The best thing japan could do is be independant and neutral, using good diplomacy to pacify relations with china at the same time maintaining good will with the US.


Independant yes neutral no. Japan will need to take a side in the future my friend and the path taken should be solely based on what japan can receive from the relationship.

QUOTE
But as expected some cheap mouths in japan's politics are offending a growing giant in too many ways.


Indeed. Hopefully they will realize that it is not within japan's best intrest to give them more ammunition to use against us.
Hiroki
The Americans with their 'contaiment' policy of the growing Chinese power is blatantly a method of staving off the end of their time as the king of the hill. Japan cannot be so blind to this. They should not antagonize so greatly a superpower that is literally 300-ish kms westward. Im not saying for Japan to be China's b!tch, but to be cordial yet cautious of what they may do. In 100 years, all 1st and 2nd hand knowledge of those terrible times will have faded and perhaps friendship may even occur.

Japan needs to rearm. STAT. And kick out the yanks and start running her foreign policy that would suit her best. Not what some pen pushers over in washington thinks.
Chinese DesertFox
QUOTE (Hiroki @ Mar 10 2005, 12:18 AM)
The Americans with their 'contaiment' policy of the growing Chinese power is blatantly a method of staving off the end of their time as the king of the hill.  Japan cannot be so blind to this.  They should not antagonize so greatly a superpower that is literally 300-ish kms westward. Im not saying for Japan to be China's b!tch, but to be cordial yet cautious of what they may do.  In 100 years,  all 1st and 2nd hand knowledge of those terrible times will have faded and perhaps friendship may even occur.

Japan needs to rearm. STAT. And kick out the yanks and start running her foreign policy that would suit her best.  Not what some pen pushers over in washington thinks.
*

Which is why Japan should mend her relations with China. You can start by giving us an official apology, we'll let time heal the rest.
Musashino
I think Japan will offer China an apology and compensate for past damages. I just don't think it'll happen anytime soon simply because tensions between both countries is extremely high and neither one will do anything to 'lose face' or give the other a moral and psychological advantage.

It's just unfortunate that Japan's past monetary compensation to China was mainly used by the CCP for infrastructure and building the economy, rather than directly compensating victims of war crimes.

I, for one, would love to see China and Japan resolve their differences. It's just ironic how in the distant past, relations between the two have been quite cordial, since China was Japan's official mentor (i.e. China was what America is now to Japan - an idol).
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