Translation:

Many Chinese historians suggest that the citizens of Beijing should organize a thanksgiving celebration to honor the architect Nguyễn Anh, a Vietnamese man, who designed and constructed their capital of Beijing, the architecture of which is considered perfect.

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Does anybody here know something about this? Chinese AF members have often bragged that Vietnamese architecture copied on existing Chinese architectural stylings. It seems, on the contrary, that the Vietnamese architectural experience acquired in the construction of Thành Cổ Loa has been used in that of Beijing?

dammit how come he designed beijing all good and the person who designed hue ALL FREAKING UGLY..

i dont know what to say cept i dont know anything about it and it should be honored then

That's hilarious, considering it was the Indians who built the pagodas and similar architectures first. And the Chinese also brags about building the first compass. Uh..no..it was one of the ancient European countries. Next, I'm sure they'll claim walls are their inventions too.



Good luck with that - it seems like they're too self-centered to acknowledge anyone else's achievements that they've taken advantage of, especially when they've had several hundred years to give formal recognition to Nguyen Anh but never have.

haha i didnt know any of that

check out this site... http://www.orientalarchitecture.com/
and see which looks better, beijings looks awesome,

i dont get it. how come he can design an imperial for china that looks so good and not design a really good one for us, his own country. that mans a fool...

so even if we use that same architecture today, haha it wouldnt be called china's ITS OUR ARCHITECTURE we designed it.. lol cool.

his ARCHITECTURE is based on chinese architecture...
in china we have that kinda architecture long before 1420

Yes, but your architecture is based on Indian architecture. I don't understand why Chinese try to claim everything as theirs. If they truly believe it's theirs, then those people should have actually tried to do some research before making ignorant statements.

haha o well beijing looks tiite...... its very CREaTIVE. chinese are lucky its still not messed up like our imperial hue.

EDIT: just noticed phuoc loc tho, or asian garden mall here in garden grove has like the same architecture too...

are u sure?? Indian look whole lot different than china..

http://reference.allrefer.com/encyclopedia/P/pagoda.html

"Those of India (see stupa) are chiefly pyramidal structures of masonry, tapering to an apex and elaborately adorned with carving and sculpture. In China the pagoda, derived from India, is one of the most characteristic architectural types and in general is devoted to sacred usage."

As for the compass not being a Chinese invention, I can provide a scanned page to show you that the compass has been invented thousands of years before the Chinese ever first started to use it. But that will have to wait until this weekend.

yeah pagoda are introduced by indian, that is when they pass the buddism to china. but what about otehr building?? i think that is 100%chinese,

What other buildings are there? The modern skyscrapers are Western inventions. Everything else are pagodas or something based on pagodas. And if you're not sure about your own country's architecture, maybe you should do some research yourself and not rely on a Vietnamese to tell you about your country.

o well, its not like chinas the only one who uses taht architecture... koreans japanese and vietnamese all share the same architecture, but with a little difference between each. The buildings aren't all just pagodas and stuff they are also homes for the 4 asians too, But i'm probably sure the chinese buildings aren't a hundred percent chinese made.

koreans architecture looks closest to chinese though.

This site also talks a bit about the many aspects of chinese culture that were derived from India, architecture also included.

http://www.atributetohinduism.com/India_and_China.htm

wait wait..... buddism wasn't introduced to china until Tang Dynasty,
what about those Tang palace, qin palace??

From: The Cambridge History of China (Vol. VII).

Got this from Supernovasp.

Note: Annamese is the old name for Vietnamese for those who don't know.

Chinese architecture, Architecture

Through the T'ang and Sung dynasties, Chinese architecture retained the basic characteristics already developed in the Han, although there was a greater technical mastery and a tendency toward rich adornment and complexity of the system of bracketing. Though little survives of the wooden structures, our knowledge of their appearance comes from detailed representations in painted scrolls, especially by the Li school of artists in the T'ang period and their followers (see Chinese art).

Extant monuments in Japan, profoundly influenced by Chinese architecture, also reflect the progress of Chinese building techniques. Examples are the 7th-century monastery of Horyu-ji and the 8th-century monastery of Toshodai-ji. In the Ming period the complex of courtyards, parks, and palaces became labyrinthian in scope. Little remains of the imperial palaces at Nanjing, the capital of the Ming dynasty until 1421.

I don't know anything about the Tang or Qin palace...like I said, if you want to be able to know for sure if this and that was of Chinese origins or not, then do research.

if u don't know, don't say everything from China are based on Indian..

Dude HUE is NOT UGLY. Some of the buildings were blacken because of the VIETNAM WAR, where there was a huge battle and many buildings were destroyed and become black. You never heard of the Battle of Hue???

Anyway Hue is not ugly here are some pictures of it.

Here's what I said:

"it was the Indians who built the pagodas and similar architectures first."

Not everything but a lot of things.

http://www.atributetohinduism.com/India_and_China.htm

That's a fu-ked-up lie there. There were very primitive compasses developed by the Vikings, however the standard one, which now is based off was by chinese design.
And Byron, 70% pictures you posted are not from Hue

i meant the new architecture of hue is ugly, i've been looking into the architecture and the way they designed imperial hue is ugly.... i mean the buildings..
but the old architecture like the perfume pagoda and one pillar pagoda is one of the nicest architecture. Like Hue Buildings doesnt have that strong look because like they dont have those things that support the roofing, imma have to show you pictures for you to know but i think it looks soo simple easy to build and weak. But co loa and the hanoi architecture looks neat and pretty compared to hue imperial.

In my honese opinions, Southeast Asian architeture especially the Burmese one are way more superior than Vietnamese and East Asian etc. It's just my taste

I'll provide the scanned page from the book that I'm getting this from for you next weekend. You can decide whether or not improvements on it are enough to warrant a whole new invention. As far as I'm concerned, a compass is a compass. Just because AT&T invented the first cordless phone (not sure if AT&T actually did, but you get the point), it doesn't mean it should be credited for invention of the "standard" telephone, while ignoring Alexander Graham Bell.

To Tam_Ca the guy who designed the Beijing palace is not the same guy who designed Hue. Hue was designed in the 1800's I believe.



I like the painted glass supporting columns of this room.

only thing that was introduced by indian is Pagoda..
but indian pagoda are ugly...

AT&T used Bell Grahams method to develope cordless wirephone. Most modern compasses ARE still based on the Chinese ones.

Anyway,
Burmese royal palace beats all Asian architectures

gosh.. there is compass long time ago, but they are like water compass..
only china developed the compass that uses needle


that palace is ugly...

i know the person who designed it wasnt the same, thats why i said why did he design beijing all good and the PERSON who designed hue all crappy.





you see the roofing details, HUE looks soo simple and verry week like you can just break it...
and the other one is a building in s korea, the under part of the roof looks very supportive, strong, very good look too.

see what i mmean... vietnams imperial hue building is ugly not nice coloring, and it looks like it has some western influence or something, i like the more older architecture like the van mieu architecture.. some strong looking nice coloring buildings that fits in with the environment around it, trees etc.

Apparently, you didn't get the point. I can name any other inventions that improvements were made on and is now "the standard," but it doesn't mean the engineer that made the improvements can be considered the inventor. For example, Charles Babbage is the person credited for the invention of the computer, yet, it was a purely mechanical system, which is far different from today's digital computers. Does it suddenly mean IBM invented the computer? Like I said, you can come up with justifications to fit your own interpretations of a "standard" invention in use today if doing that makes you happy. But I'm going to give credit to those who actually came up with the idea for the invention that solves a problem, no matter how primitive it is, so I'm not going to debate you further on this.





And to you, the addition of a needle to the compass, makes the compass a Chinese invention?

haha check out the site i posted. they have wayy better looking buildings, sorry to say lol.

This thread reminds me of this thread

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.p...ghlight=compass

The guy tried to prove that Chinese didn't invent compass

I've been there many times...

And yea I like the Hanoi old buildings more than Hue... In my opinion, Hue isn't that nice... except some houses

i think these vietnamese architecture looks really nice....
http://perso.club-internet.fr/gilkergu/index.htm#

Johann, is that your site. Some of those pictures are thumbnails..it would be really great if you provide the large, full picture too.

It's not his site

I have to agree with you on this. Burma, Tibet and Nepal have this wonderful mixture of indian and east asian architecture that's it beautiful.

oh, sorry, it's not mine. But I think you can click again on the thumbnails, and they'll become larger pictures - though not full-screen.

Amazing to think a Vietnamese man has designed and conducted the construction of Beijing from 1406 to 1420. I've been reading it.

<< Đặc biệt bài viết này được nhiều thân hữu yêu cầu để phần nào trả lời cho luận điệu thưc dân văn hóa Tầu cho rằng người Việt Nam không có kiến trúc riêng mà chỉ “bắt chước” Tầu mà thôi. >>

In fact Vietnam was not bothered by Chinese invasion any more since the capital of China moved from Nanjing to Beijing?

Didn't I tell you already that we got invaded by the Ming for 20 years, those 20 years were the SECOND sinocization of Vietnam.

So you're saying China stole our best architect, made him a eunich (so his genius can't be passed on) and left us with the artitect of Hue? LOL, this is truly sad... SAD!!!

Actually Hue isn't bad, but it might've been better if he stayed.

hue isnt that bad, but it doesnt look like a great architect style like beijing, and it has too many western influence in it. check out the old pictures of hue, it looks more like a western palace. with an asian roof on top, but inside asian style.

The Ming Dynasty lasted for 276 years with 16 emperors occupying the throne.

When did the Ming re-established the Jiaozhi Prefecture?

In which 20 years did that happen?

I read more here, but can't find the exact period.

http://www.uglychinese.org/vietnamese.htm

History of the navigational compass

Compasses were initially used in mysticism in ancient China. The first known use of Earth's magnetic field in this way occurred in ancient China as a spectacle. Arrows were cast similarly to dice. These magnetised arrows aligned themselves pointing north, impressing the audience. Curiously, it took some time for this trick to get used by the Chinese for naval navigation, but by the 11th or early 12th century it had become common.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compass#Histo...ational_compass

Ingnorant history distorter.

1407: Chinese occupation Ming.
1428: After his victory against the Chinese armies, with the aid of Nguyen Trai, Le Loi begins the second Le dynasty, which sees further annexions in the South.


You forgot LE LOI ALREADY?

The UglyChinese site was kind of bad for it's report on the Viet war with Mongol. It made it seem like the ONLY reason why Mongols left was because of disease, not ever mentioning great stategies by us Viet as the puncturing of the boats to destroy most of their sea fleet etc... So after reading just one section, if the information is THAT incomplete, screw it, i'm not surprised it didn't tell you about the Ming Dynasty.

Ming Chen Zu
(1,403 – 1,425 A.D.)

Death of Tamerlane; Mongol Empire disintegrated (1,405 A.D.)

Seven voyages of Zheng He to the South (1,405 – 1,433 A.D.), reaching as far as the east coast of Africa. Sent messengers to Japan and occupied Vietnam (1,406 A.D.). Constructed Dong (East ) Chang (1,420 A.D.). Moved to Beijing (1,420 A.D.)

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So it was at that time Beijing was constructed. I mean, after that, they did not invade Vietnam any more !

I dislike Le Loi, because I prefer a truer hero: Nguyễn Trãi, and his friend Trần Nguyên Hãn (you know, the statue in front of the Bến Thành central market).